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The Growing Threat of Right-Wing Christians

By Onnesha Roychoudhuri, AlterNet. Posted July 19, 2006.


Michelle Goldberg says progressives need to wake up and pay attention to the enormous -- and growing -- influence of the radical Christian right.

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"I don't want to be alarmist, but this is actually quite alarming," Michelle Goldberg said. She was referring to the subject of her new book, "Kingdom Coming: The Rise of Christian Nationalism," which chronicles the steady rise of the neocons of Christianity.

Whether she's attending a Ten Commandments conference or joining Tony Perkins' conference calls to listen in on what D.C. agenda will be passed on to congregations, Goldberg's reporting offers insight into a movement that has reshaped the nation's political and cultural landscape. Goldberg did not go undercover, nor wear any disguise. Rather, she simply showed up, listened and learned. And what she has learned is definitely alarming.

Traveling around the country on her book tour, Goldberg notes that many people have approached her with stories that illustrate the religious intolerance that is the hallmark of an aggressive Christian movement. On a muggy day in Brooklyn, Goldberg sat down with me to discuss the need for Americans -- particularly progressives and liberals -- to recognize the sophisticated intellectual structure of Christian Nationalism, and how it has succeeded in constructing a parallel reality based on Biblical rhetoric and revisionist history.

Onnesha Roychoudhuri: How did the idea for the book come about?

Michelle Goldberg: I've done reporting on the subject for a long time. One of the first pieces I did on the Christian right was on the ex-gay movement. What struck me going to the Exodus Conference was that it takes place in this whole entire parallel universe. They have their own psychologists, psychological institutions and their own version of professional medical literature. The amount of books, magazines and media, and the way it almost duplicated everything that we have in our so-called reality, is remarkable. What struck me years later when I was reporting on the Bush administration was that the parallel institutions that I had first come into contact with were replacing the mainstream institutions -- especially in the federal bureaucracy.

Roychoudhuri: Can you give an example?

Goldberg: In the Department of Health and Human Services, the people they hired to formulate sex education policy, at both the national and international level, didn't come from the American Medical Association or the big medical schools. They're coming from places like the Medical Institute for Sexual Health, which is this Christian Nationalist medical group. [The group says it is a "nonprofit scientific, educational organization to confront the global epidemics of non-marital pregnancy."]

One of the earlier stories I did for Salon was on the UNFPA (United Nations Population Fund) which does family planning, but they don't do abortion, mostly safe childcare and reproductive health through clinics all over the world. Congress had appropriated $35 million to the UNFPA. There's this group called the Population Research Institute -- another one of these parallel institutions. They're radically anti-family planning and claim that population control policies are part of this "one-world conspiracy" to cull the population of the faithful so that the "one-world government" can more easily assert its control. On the website it said that not only is overpopulation a myth, but all the people on Earth could live comfortably in the state of Texas. I did this story in 2002. I still had this naïve idea that this kind of thing would remain marginal.

But what's amazing is that Population Research Institution went on to testify before Congress saying that the UNFPA promotes forced abortions in China. These kinds of accusations start echoing up the ladder to the point where Bush froze the UNFPA funding. This despite the fact that the State Department had already sent a delegation to China to investigate and said there was nothing to these accusations at all.

There's a myth on the left that's been fostered by Thomas Frank. I think it's a mistake to think that the religious right hasn't got anything. Frank has fostered this idea that the right votes to end abortion and gets a repeal of the estate tax. They've actually gotten quite a bit. One of the main ways they are rewarded below the radar is by being given vast amounts of control over American family planning policy abroad.

Roychoudhuri: What is "Christian Nationalism" and what characterizes it as a political movement?

Goldberg: Christian Nationalism is a political ideology separate from evangelicals. Evangelicals are about 30 percent of the American population. Christian Nationalism is a subset of 10-15 percent. It's less a religion than it is an ideology about the way America should be governed. It has this whole revisionist history claiming that America was founded as a Christian nation, that the separation of church and state is a fraud perpetrated by seculars. What follows from that are ideas about Christianization of institutions in American life, and that the courts have vastly overstepped their authority in the enforcement of the separation of church and state.


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Onnesha Roychoudhuri is a former assistant editor of AlterNet.

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The term they want is "clerical fascism."
Posted by: wli on Jul 19, 2006 2:30 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
A quick definition can be found at the wikipedia article on clerical fascism.

The alarm had been sounding nonstop since the first Red Scare in 1917 but was melted into silence by the raging flames. The US' right wing, for instance, has even developed its own Vietnam War Dolchstoßlegende literally based on nothing more than the Rambo novel and movie. Christian zealots and neo-Nazis have mass infiltrated the military to the point Jews are forced to flee military academies and white supremacists are stocking up on military weaponry smuggled out from Iraq, generals are proclaiming George W. Bush to be ordained by God (his most inflammatory quotes seem to have been purged or censored -- sorry), and there's no effective opposition to any of this.

Saying "it's going to get worse before it gets better" is like saying Iran will eventually move away from a religious fundamentalist theocracy in 1979. You need to get it through your thick heads: this can easily last for centuries and will most likely outlive you. The US government was overthrown outright in the 2000 judicial coup d'etat, not that it was particularly clean before then (c.f. 1876 if nothing else). You don't get your government or country back by voting. You don't get it back at all.

IMNSHO this is not merely the downfall of the US into Iranian-flavored Christian theocracy. This is the beginning of a new Dark Age. The US is far from the only nominal democracy falling into the clutches of authoritarianism; the entire Anglosphere is marching in lockstep with their police state measures and the rest of the so-called "free world" is only a few steps behind, all this in the face of the rather fervent opposition of their constituencies. All questions are answered with force; all debate is one-sided. Rationality itself is repudiated the world over.

(Those familiar with Cold War espionage will likely understand why which countries went along and when.)

The world is on fire. The houses of freedom are all burning into the night. The Enlightenment is over. This New Dark Age will last as long as the reigns of the pharaohs in Egypt and the kings of medieval Europe. If you dare ask why, I will explain to you how ideas and ideologies are killed.

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» End of the Enlightenment? Posted by: ungerbn
» What is enlightenment? Posted by: Lauren
» RE: What is enlightenment? Posted by: aussidawg
» RE: End of the Enlightenment? Posted by: doctorsquared
» Don't give up Posted by: Lincoln fan
What's missing here
Posted by: kenhymes on Jul 19, 2006 3:26 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Nowhere does Goldberg even mention the fact that religious people used to play a large role in leftist politics, and that the secular left walked away from that. Also missing is an understanding of just how lazy the left, both religious and secular, has been over the last thirty years, both in institution-building and in grass roots organizing. The "ground war" of politics has been largely ceded to the right, and we have put way too much trust in large foundations putting out position papers, in groups like the Sierra Club, and in national elections.

Scorn of leftist Christians is rampant from all sides, and yet these were some of the heroes of our past (MLK, Dorothy Day, the Berrigans, the Sanctuary Movement during the Central American terror wars). It's fine for people like Goldberg to point out how scary the beliefs and political success of the "Christian" right are, but it's not of any use tactically. I have seen very few signs that the non-Christian left has any interest in working with Christians who share their social values.

On the other hand, the right wing push in churches is actually largely spent, as Goldberg would know if she were truly immersed in what's going on out there. Those churches aren't going to disappear, and their hateful rhetoric and political acitvities need to be dealt with in the political sphere. But the new growth, and the new thinking, is all moving left, on issues from the environment to social justice.

In general, Christians in America are just as diverse and divided politically as the rest of the country. The difference is that the GOP has learned the value of welcoming right-wing religious people into their efforts. When people like Jim Wallis and the folks at Tikkun, suggest the left do likewise, they are met with patronizing scorn for the most part. And so the left loses a huge chunk of its potential local network.

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» RE: What's missing here Posted by: Samantha Vimes
» RE: What's missing here Posted by: kenhymes
» RE: What's missing here Posted by: Lizmv
» RE: What's missing here Posted by: Joshua Holland
» RE: What's missing here Posted by: YogiBear
» RE: What's missing here Posted by: Joshua Holland
» RE: What's missing here Posted by: YogiBear
» RE: What's missing here Posted by: outsidea
» RE: What's missing here Posted by: MatthewSavage
» RE: What's missing here Posted by: outsidea
» RE: What's missing here Posted by: MatthewSavage
» RE: What's missing here Posted by: YogiBear
» RE: What's missing here Posted by: Joshua Holland
» RE: What's missing here Posted by: MatthewSavage
» RE: What's missing here Posted by: Kym525
» RE: What's missing here Posted by: moenbailey
» RE: What's missing here Posted by: rverne8
» RE: What's missing here Posted by: mstenger
There's no solution because...
Posted by: riffraff2001 on Jul 19, 2006 4:41 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
the U.S. is a Christian nation that isn't supposed to be. According to the Constitution, there's supposed to be religious freedom and separation of church and state. However, a majority of people in this country are Christian, and many of them believe that it is their duty to live according to their god's law above U.S. law. But that can sometimes get people thrown in jail. So they try to change U.S. law to coincide with religious law. Democrats should be appalled at this, but a majority of democrats are also Christians, and there are many issues where they agree with the religious right. There are many people who consider themselves to be democrats that also think homosexuality is a sin, and so believe homosexuals shouldn't be allowed to marry. So the real problem (as I've said before) is that there is a Christian majority. As long as there are conservatives and liberals who have a mutual distaste for non-Christians or the non-religious, then there cannot be a solution to this problem.

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» RE: There's no solution because... Posted by: riffraff2001
» RE: There's no solution because... Posted by: BlueStateBitch
» American Indians and Children. Posted by: aussidawg
» There's no solution and get this... Posted by: riffraff2001
» RE: There's no solution and get this... Posted by: BlueStateBitch
gramps
Posted by: gramps on Jul 19, 2006 4:48 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The pledge of alliegence is a loyalty oath. The addition of God to it makes it even more of a disgrace. It is said with the right arm extended in a fascist salute.

The real danger of the religious right is its connection with Zionism. It is the Zionists who are antisemitic. Their attack on the Arabs is racist and antisemitic because Arabs are semites. The United States of Israel
Israel is very concerned about Hezbollah getting rockets from Iran but nobody asks where a country the size of New Jersey gets their tanks, planes, artillery, and over 700 atomic bombs from. The answer is that they buy them from the United States with the billions of dollars they get from the United States. Like Haliburton who gets billion dollar no-bid contracts from the United States, they can afford to spend the money because it comes from the United States taxpayer anyway. The AARP or American Association of Retired People have a big lobby in Washington, but AIPAC, the American Israeli Public Affairs Committee lobby is bigger. Where does the money come from to spend buying Congressmen? The answer is that the congressmen have just passed an appropriation bill giving Israel 3 billion dollars. They have received 140 billion over the past fifty years.

Over 89% of American Jews vote Democratic. The vast majority of American Jews opposed the Iraq war, (more were against it than in the general population) and American Jews have been enormously important in securing civil liberties for all Americans. But the ruling party in Israel is the Likud and they use their positions to support Likud policies in the American government. All this can happen because there is a vacuum in U.S. political discourse., A handful of special interests in the United States virtually dictate congressional policy on some issues. With regard to the Arab Israeli conflict, The American Israel Public Affairs Committee and a few allies have succeeded in imposing complete censorship on both houses of Congress. No Senator or Representative dares make a speech on the floor of his or her institution critical of Israeli policy.”

The blanket of censorship covers the American media also. Even some of the most progressive Jews are afraid to speak their true thoughts on the Israeli expansionist policies in the Middle East. They are even afraid of their own friends and family as the Likud policies dominate every synagogue. After the total destruction of Iraq carried out by the neo-cons by lying to the American people about “weapons of mass destruction” They are now destroying Lebanon, and would have the United States make war with Iran.

Why? because Iran wants to build an atomic reactor. Who wouldn’t want an atom bomb when a sworn enemy has hundreds of them? Israel is a warlike nationalistic state run by Zionists. No other country has attacked the United States since Pearl Harbor except when Israel attacked the USS Liberty in international waters. No congressional investigation of this vicious assault has been held. It has been kept out of the press and the media but the veterans of the USS Liberty are on the web. Google over to their site and check it out.

The greatest and most powerful country in the world is hostage to the Zionists. The end of the Cold War left the arms industry hanging but Israel is giving them an excuse to keep making more nuclear submarines. Israel is providing them with their life’s blood . . . WAR.

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» RE: gramps Posted by: oafling
» labels Posted by: russianblue1
» You - Intelligent? As if . . . Posted by: FauxPorteno
» RE: gramps Posted by: Pickles78
» Defining anti-semitism Posted by: brunowe
» RE: Defining anti-semitism Posted by: ConnecttheDots
» RE: gramps Posted by: scotty46
» RE: gramps Posted by: kit79
» RE: gramps Posted by: jiminator
maudlin
Posted by: rsaxto on Jul 19, 2006 4:58 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
How can you describe a bunch of right wing dogma-believing anti-intellectuals as having a "sophisticated intellectual structure" when they are just a maudlin bunch of dogma fiends?

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» RE: maudlin Posted by: Lauren
RE: These Christians are crazy. They must be stopped.
Posted by: Paul D on Jul 19, 2006 5:19 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Poor little troll.

the assault on decency that is learning about homosexuality.

That made me laugh. Where, exactly, are 1st graders "taught" homosexuality?

No where.

Yet another in a long series of straw men from "prod". Keep 'em comin'. You make it so easy.

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RE: These Christians are crazy. They must be stopped.
Posted by: Lincoln fan on Jul 19, 2006 5:30 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
You are right. Christian and Islamic self-righteous intolerance is dangerous and a threat to our lives.

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Ummm... look around
Posted by: kenhymes on Jul 19, 2006 6:16 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Josh Holland has been criticized by me on other topics, so I'm not surprised at his criticism in return.

As for my assertion that scorn of Christians is rampant on the left, I don't have to search the archives. This article and others like it on Alternet in the last two years amply demonstrate the lack of interest in really investigating Christianity in America, but rather looking always at its most reactionary practitioners. The writers on Alternet don't represent the entire left, as much as they might wish to think so. Read the responses to writers like Jim Rigby and Jim Wallis and people from Tikkun when their articles are posted on Alternet and on HuffPost, and the kind of reaction Christians get from fellow progressives is shown in abundance.

For that matter, I have posted many many times, usually in a very measured tone, sometimes in exasperation, and the response is always similar to Holland's: mocking, and unable to even engage the tactical points I am making.

No one ever seems to be able to acknowledge that a caricature of Christianity as inherently reactionary is even possibly a mistake. As for the poster who said I was privileging Christianity above other faiths, that's nowhere in my post, that's in their head, or in their experiences with some other kind of Christian.

My church is out there with the homeless, advocating for peace, building alternative structures to make up for the utter lack of effective action by local government. We're Christians, and we're following Jesus, and that to us means helping the poor and the vulnerable. Where are the concrete proposals or recommended courses of action on Alternet? Criticism is easy. Action is hard.

The subject is always subtly changed when I point out that while the left in the 60's and early 70's was busy building alternative institutions and addressing real needs, the left now is simply talking about what's wrong with all those stupid reactionaries.

The reason the right was so successful for so long is that they ignored their losses in Washington and engaged people on the local level. They did it dishonestly, and and hid their true agenda much of the time. But they did it.

The left has been losing ground PRECISELY since the rise of the evangelical right alienated Jewish and secular leftists from Christianity, and understandably so. But this was a crucial tactical error. And if you care more about the nation our children will live in than in being right about everything all the time, you'll take another look at that decision.

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» RE: Ummm... shifting the goalpost Posted by: Joshua Holland
» RE: Ummm... shifting the goalpost Posted by: kernowkensa
» RE: Ummm... look around Posted by: Kym525
» Such thin-skinned Apostles ... Posted by: AdamSelene40
Equal is Special and Special is Equal
Posted by: LMNOP on Jul 19, 2006 6:32 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Don't that beat all? After years of Christian bumper stickers commanding that there be "no special rights" for gays with regard to civil unions.

So, when it comes to non-Christians, equal rights are special rights. But when it comes to Christians being excluded from having to respect the equal rights of the non-Christian potential hire, "the Christian Nationalist movement [is] pushing for special privileges under the banner of equal rights".

It must be tough to be a decent Christian when such people are trashing your religion. Oh wait, it's just like being a decent American and having to face the world after the neocons.

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Religion and Politics
Posted by: daw13 on Jul 19, 2006 6:55 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
From a political point of view, the Christian Right appears to be operating quite rationally.

When I met Thomas Frank, the author of What's the Matter With Kansas I told him that I had connected the dots he presented in his book in a way that he had not done specifically. He had observed how people being damaged economically by the policies of those they supported on religious grounds, seemed a bit baffled but pleased by this support. He concluded that this appeared to indicate that among the citizenry, fanatical belief had trumped common sense. It seemed to me, on the other hand, that the consequence of the new apparently belief-based organization on the right that Frank described was to give little WASPS a source of power they had lacked in the past. He himself had described how leaders did not worship the Incumbent. Rather they insisted that he honor their needs in return for their support.

As public coffers are more and more depleted, fulfilling Grover Nordquist's strategy of starving the government of funds to the point that it can simply be drowned in the toilet, private funding for those loyal to the current regime are growing significantly. Thus are members of the religious right becoming better positioned than any other group of "little people" in the United States to protect themselves from a plummeting economy.

The primary assumption that unites the religious right --in one form or another I've heard it stated far more often by political conservatives than by liberals -- has nothing to do with religion and everything to do with politics: it is the assumption that the United States is shifting from bering a constitutional democracy, to a different model which I dare not label accurately for fear of being labeled a conspiracy theorist.

Frank did not disagree with my analysis.

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RE: These Christians are crazy. They must be stopped.
Posted by: Pickles78 on Jul 19, 2006 7:06 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Such an amusing creature you are.

Tommy Pickles

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RE: A PROGRESSIVE Christian and civil libertarian speaks
Posted by: smendler on Jul 19, 2006 7:19 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
As I recall, the timeline was supposed to be that the Second Coming would be 40 years after the re-establishment of Israel - so hopes were high for 1988!

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RE: These Christians are crazy. They must be stopped.
Posted by: agapegirl on Jul 19, 2006 7:37 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
"People that think their children deserve to go through 1st grade without the assault on decency that is learning about homosexuality."

The first time I heard about homosexuality, I was about seven years old. It was in a conversation about marriage with a friend the same age. She mentioned, "No, it's not just men and women marrying each other; women can marry women and men can marry men." It was 1971 so of course what she said was not technically true in this country. My reaction was, "Oh." What's indecent about that conversation?

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This is a great example of why the Democrats,,,
Posted by: John Rice on Jul 19, 2006 7:45 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
,,,always seem to lose--they are too busy cannibalizing each other, instead of their opponents. I mean, come on, guys--haven't you two better things to do than engage in a mutually destructive pissing contest? Sheeeeesh!

For a better understanding of other reasons why Democrats seem to lose, and might have already lost in 2008, I urge everyone to read Greg Palast's new book "Armed Madhouse", which gives great understandings of complicated issues and connects many of the dots. At least it has made things much more understandable for me.

Regards,,,John
( john_rice@neitherparty.org )

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Lets get back to basics
Posted by: jimhurt on Jul 19, 2006 8:12 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I think Americans have tired of Liberal Politics because we have lost focus. While we are worring about Abortion rights in China, the Republicans have looted the treasury and put our grandchildren into servitude.
Abortion is not the issue, we need to talk about Federal interference between a doctor and a patient.

Gay marriage isn’t the issue, we need to talk about equality for all citizens and there needs to be a serious debate about why do adults living together need shared social benefits and if there isn’t a real reason for it, it should not be a Democratic issue.

Gun control where are the stats that show something that works? We should support any position on gun control that police officers support. When did the Democrats decide to become the party that doesn't support the cop on the street?

Education, take the Federal Government out of the testing business and lets go back to libraries and facilities let the counties set curriculum. How about a Federal internet clearinghouse for teaching materials? We need to become the party of ideas and of simple facts. Less Federal Government.

I want a party that takes as much care with my civil rights as it does with my tax dollars.

rant over... :)

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» RE: Lets get back to basics Posted by: outsidea
» RE: Lets get back to basics Posted by: jimhurt
» RE: Lets get back to basics Posted by: YogiBear
» RE: Lets get back to basics Posted by: Kym525
» Whose basics? Posted by: CovertRage
» RE: Whose basics? Posted by: jimhurt
enough, Josh
Posted by: kenhymes on Jul 19, 2006 8:13 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
You are a willfully ignorant man, Josh. I have raised point after point about the place of religion in the history of the left, that you refuse to acknowledge or respond to, perhaps because of some deeply held discomfort about this topic.

You mock and criticize everything I say, make no attempt to discuss the tactics or the process of movement building that are central to this problem, and you then accuse me of not providing examples of this mocking and mindless bashing. Don't need to, Josh, you're providing the examples by yourself.

What is the deal with writers on this site, that they don't even know the history of the left? You use a shoddy debating tactic, by dismissing any point raised that is related to the topic as irrelevant because it is not explicitly mentioned in the original piece. That's not discussion, or analysis.

Goldberg, and other writers like her, are obsessed with the influence of the reactionaries in the church. She says that Thomas Frank has created a "myth" among the left that the religious right doesn't ever get what it wants. That's not a myth that's apparently held by many people who write on Alternet lol. Quite the reverse. To hear you and others here tell it, there is nothing the religious right doesn't get from the GOP. The naivete and the lack of curiosity about the diversity in the church are astonishing.

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» Just back up the claim, Ken ... Posted by: Joshua Holland
» Truly dishonest ... Posted by: Joshua Holland
» RE: enough, Josh Posted by: Polly
» RE: enough, Josh Posted by: outsidea
Christians offended--read more carefully
Posted by: supercrisp on Jul 19, 2006 8:26 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I see a lot of posts here that seem defensive because of the articles critique of Christian Nationalism. That is not all Christians.

I will say however that Christians posting here who feel threatened by the left abandoning them have good reason, at least if I’m anyone to judge by. I wish all you folks would disappear into your various heavens with your spooks, haints, saints, and insulting beliefs. Why?

1) I’m sick of religious nuts squabbling over some pissant hole in the ground.
2) I’m really annoyed by the presumption of many of you that I am not a moral being without adhering to your Candyland fantasies.
3) There’s no concealing the very real misogyny, homophobia, xenophobia and the 31 other flavors of hate tucked away in Christian, Jewish, and Islamic teaching.
4) You don’t keep your own damn house in order; why are you people here whinging about non-believers uniting with you against the Christian fascists when you should be out there educating those people in your own particular self-deceiving tolerant view of your religion?
5) You don’t mind your damn business. Stick your sumptuary laws in your tookus.
6) You are hypocrites. My most liberal and devout agape-mouthing Christian friends still live in nice upper middle class homes and spend plenty of time looking our for number one instead of the least among us.

So if you want to be offended, be offended at me. Not at someone pointing out the obvious nascent fascism blossoming in America--which has ALWAYS been prone that way anyway.

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RE: These Christians are crazy. They must be stopped.
Posted by: astraea on Jul 19, 2006 8:32 AM   
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Your sarcasm belies a contempt for other people that, surely, isn't Christian.
Keep that love flowing!

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Simple Request
Posted by: NoPCZone on Jul 19, 2006 8:31 AM   
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Just as all Democrats are not Progressives, not all Christians-- even Evangelicals-- do not subscribe to the NeoCon agenda or 'Christian Nationalism'. Please do not throw the baby out with the bath water. There is a lot of common ground that many Christians of various denominations and the Progressive Movement.

I am a Christian, a member of a denomination that is commonly referred to as evangelical and hold the following beliefs:

1- Wise environmental policy & sustainable development is not only the right thing to do-- it fits perfectly within the Christian Teaching of Stewardship.
2- Universal Healthcare & Education is and should be treated as the basic human rights they are.
3- Separation of Religion and Government is not only the founder's intent, it is also a protection for people of every faith or non-faith.
4- Discrimination against anyone for what sex or color they are, where they come from, who or what they worship and who they choose to partner with is wrong and endangers the rights of all.
5- Civil Unions are the business of government-- not the Church.
6- Pseudo-science does not belong in science textbooks, science classrooms or political policy.
7- Support for human rights, universal suffrage and democracy should be the number one priority of our foreign policy.
8- The death penalty is barbaric and should be eliminated.
9- We need to bring our military home from overseas and restructure it as a purely defensive force.
10- We, as a people, owe many parts of the world a huge apology for our heavy handed meddling and intervention in their internal affairs.

When you use a broad brush and lump all Christians in with the loonies you not only insult people like me, you also hurt the very causes you are working toward. I am not alone.

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» RE: Simple Request Posted by: Joshua Holland
» RE: Simple Request Posted by: NoPCZone
» Um, you don’t get it... Posted by: supercrisp
» RE: Um, you don’t get it... Posted by: ariessag
» RE: Um, you don’t get it... Posted by: MatthewSavage
» RE: Um, you don’t get it... Posted by: YogiBear
» RE: Simple Request Posted by: owleyes
» RE: Simple Request Posted by: NoPCZone
» THEN Posted by: Ahimsa
RE: These Christians are crazy. They must be stopped.
Posted by: buffaloT on Jul 19, 2006 8:57 AM   
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95% of "christians" are the worst kinds of hypocrites. These "life savers" twist the teachings of their "savior" into intolerance, alienation and warmongering. But Jesus is smiling down on them.

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Holy Cow! There is a religious left!
Posted by: scajomar on Jul 19, 2006 9:27 AM   
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I was heartened to read in my hometown paper yesterday that three (count 'em: three) Jewish peace groups protested in front of the Israeli embassy against Israel's over-reactive military response to Hezbollah. Kudos to Jewish Voice for Peace, Jews for a Free Palestine, and Break the Silence Mural and Arts Project, who had the guts to stand up against the cultural sacred cow of Israel.

It's time we break the silence and start saying what we've all been thinking — that as long as the U.S. continues to arm Israel, the Israelis will never have the motivation to come to the table. Why talk when you can shoot/bomb/blow up/bulldoze your perceived enemy?

Gramps is right: until the U.S. stops funding the Haliburton machine (the only winner in this sad conflict), there is no end in sight to the trouble in the Middle East. We must even the stakes in the conflict. [Anyone who says these stakes are already even is not paying attention; Iran and Syria do not send rocks to Palestinian boys. There's enough money in the Arab/Persian/Muslim world to blow Israel off the map yesterday, and the will. It is the Arab world outside of Palestine that has shown the most restraint in this conflict.]

I'm writing letters today (real letters, on paper, with postage) to my US Rep and both Senators to say "It's time we start talking about censuring Israel, and the way to start is by withholding money earmarked for military use and by ending the legal sale of American armaments to Israel."

I'm so weary of the world going along with the notion that "God" "gave" "Israel" to a group of people. What utter nonsense. "God" certainly is not any one people's exclusive real estate agent. Those of us who value living in a secularist society must stop co-opting this belief.

We must first work to live together as real human beings, respectful of all minds and bodies, all families and property; only then can we learn to live together as spiritual beings with distinct beliefs. To try to engage in civilized problem solving as "religious" people first is disastrous. Nearly 60 years of conflict in Israel and the occupied Palestinian territories is proof enough of that.

It is my hope that the blind religiosity of the American Christian movement will suffer the same dogged beleaguring as Israel, and will be forced, eventually, to use brains first, faith second. This will only happen if enough of us keep dogging the right and speaking truth to power.

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Now wait a minute, prod...
Posted by: Habaro on Jul 19, 2006 9:49 AM   
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"These are people that think sucking the brains out of a late-term baby is just not cool."

Are you trying to tell me that there's NEVER been a Christian on Fear Factor?

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Relax, You've Won.
Posted by: coldeye on Jul 19, 2006 9:50 AM   
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Read any conservative website, Free Republic, Human Events. Peruse Coulter or Hannity's site or listen to their medi commentary. They are unhappy. Very unhappy. No prayer in schools, little or no reference to God at public events, rising single mom stats, more people out of closet and a defensive "defense" of marriage that has been inconsistent in success. Single people cohabitating more and more. Outside of the fundementalist sects, fewer and fewer people going to church or synagogue on regular basis. Muslims increasingly active in US society despite 9/11 cries.

The gay rights and abortion constitutional amendments cannot get out of Congress.

The secular political forces should give up the time they spend agonizing over a non-existent theocratic threat and devise secular solutions that have broad support from average people. Most Americans barely know much about their own religion let alone anyone else's. They want affordable housing, education and transportation, and a trip to Disney World or somewhere like that every year. It is called the American Secular Religion. If you dont like that religion, fine. That is more of a "threat" to values than Bible thumpers.

I also rarely see any criticism of the prevalence of fundementalism among African Americans or those Hispanic Americans who are "religious".

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» Not yet, we haven't Posted by: apost8
Here we go
Posted by: owleyes on Jul 19, 2006 9:53 AM   
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Sound the alarm. The Christian lunatics must be headed off at the pass. Quick, everybody, post something about how dangerous they are and how sad you are that America is transforming into a violent dictatorship. Show us that your vision of reality, unlike those crazy Christians', is balanced, clearsighted and transcendent. Maybe the other people on Alternet will be impressed and say you are very articulate and enlightened. Maybe it will turn out that you're some kind of prophet.

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» Yo Dude, THC Ministry Posted by: Lauren
» RE: Here we go Posted by: CovertRage
» RE: Here we go Posted by: owleyes
» RE: Here we go Posted by: CovertRage
» RE: Here we go Posted by: owleyes
On the use of religious fee